Sort of getting tired of Chris and Will trying to ride CSG out of town on a rail.

[Walkin' Willie]

Really, I am... One thing that doesn't get mentioned when it comes to BB attendance is the stinkin' economy. One didn't have to cruise far on the football boards to see many posters having to make choices about where they were going to spend their dollars re ACCCG or Sugar Bowl so I imagine that many of those same posters haven't gotten rich since January 3rd.

Look, Will - you admitted a couple of years ago that you didn't know what "going hard to the basket" meant so how are you one to really make any judgements about ANY college basketball program - well, you have the right to but not as a subject matter expert.

Chris, you have had a perpetual mad-on about CSG for two years or more - but at least two years. OK, we get it.

But you two need to understand that there are other people out there that do not agree with you - a lot of other people. Secondly, I just don't see how you fire CSG when you take into consideration our basketball history in the last 20+ years. Third, I don't think you two get how tough a sell VT basketball is to recruits, how darn tough this job really is. So quit pointing out the "problems" about CSG without having a solution. Fire CSG and hire a new coach? Who in the heck would we get? If JW fired CSG, the VT basketball job would be radioactive - i.e. it's not a destination job anyway and there are not many mid-major basketball Einsteins that would want the VT job after firing CSG. Especially after so many winning seasons and beating UNC and Duke both when they were #1 and beating them as much if not more so than 95% of the programs out there. My opinion is that you are putting football expectations on the basketball program and that is anything but fair. Remember, over half of the FBS teams get to go to bowls and get their participation trophies - only 19% of the Division I teams get to go to the tournament - a much, much tougher task.

But part of it is me - I'm just so tired of TSL right now and all the Sha Chi going on both the football and basketball boards and now I'm contributing to it. Time to take a huge break until next fall.

[133743Hokie]

I don't think it's unresonable to ask whether the program has plateaued under SG, or rather with this high profile freshman class and what is expected next year, whether he can take another step up. Again, I don't advocate firing him, but as a fan I do question where the program is and where it can realistically go.

[Chris Coleman]

Really, I am... One thing that doesn't get mentioned when it comes to BB attendance is the stinkin' economy. One didn't have to cruise far on the football boards to see many posters having to make choices about where they were going to spend their dollars re ACCCG or Sugar Bowl so I imagine that many of those same posters haven't gotten rich since January 3rd.

Look, Will - you admitted a couple of years ago that you didn't know what "going hard to the basket" meant so how are you one to really make any judgements about ANY college basketball program - well, you have the right to but not as a subject matter expert.

Chris, you have had a perpetual mad-on about CSG for two years or more - but at least two years. OK, we get it.

But you two need to understand that there are other people out there that do not agree with you - a lot of other people. Secondly, I just don't see how you fire CSG when you take into consideration our basketball history in the last 20+ years. Third, I don't think you two get how tough a sell VT basketball is to recruits, how darn tough this job really is. So quit pointing out the "problems" about CSG without having a solution. Fire CSG and hire a new coach? Who in the heck would we get? If JW fired CSG, the VT basketball job would be radioactive - i.e. it's not a destination job anyway and there are not many mid-major basketball Einsteins that would want the VT job after firing CSG. Especially after so many winning seasons and beating UNC and Duke both when they were #1 and beating them as much if not more so than 95% of the programs out there. My opinion is that you are putting football expectations on the basketball program and that is anything but fair. Remember, over half of the FBS teams get to go to bowls and get their participation trophies - only 19% of the Division I teams get to go to the tournament - a much, much tougher task.

But part of it is me - I'm just so tired of TSL right now and all the Sha Chi going on both the football and basketball boards and now I'm contributing to it. Time to take a huge break until next fall.

As far as the economy goes, it doesn't help, but it's also been bad for 5+ years. It was never a problem until this year. People are bored of VT hoops, tired of Seth, or really just don't care about hoops afterall. I don't know. But the fact is, they aren't buying tickets or coming to games. And Seth just got a big raise a couple of years ago, on top of that.

And I'm generally the first guy to point out how hard it is to recruit to Virginia Tech. I get more heat for saying that than I have for saying that Seth has taken us as far as he can take us.

Also, point out in the article where I said we should fire him. I've never written anything that flat out said a VT coach should be fired. In fact, I'm on record as saying I'm not sure Weaver is the guy to hire somebody better. I'm afraid he'd go hire Everhart, who has NEVER made the NCAA Tournament, just because it would be an easy hire and because he could get him for cheap. Everhart would be bad for the program long-term, IMO.

As far as Seth goes, as a Tech graduate (not the manager of a VT website), I'm not a huge fan of the way Seth represents the school sometimes. Too much complaining (we beat this team, but they didn't finish in top 50, we lost to this team when the were healthy, etc, etc.), and I think his comments don't sit well with the Selection Committee. How would you like to be called certifiable? I also think his coaching style can be very toxic, with the wrong group of players, especially if they get on a losing streak. That's why I'm particularly worried about this season. Finally, I don't like how he treats some people. Such as responding to question on Tech Talk Live with comments like "Well, I'm glad Tim isn't coaching the team." That's a direct quote from how he responded to someone last week, and I don't like it. That's not our culture at Tech to say things like that to people. Whoever Tim is probably didn't like it very much either. And comments like that from him are fairly common. All of that is just my opinion, as a Tech graduate and a guy who has gone to games for 10 years.

[Hubman]

Really, I am... One thing that doesn't get mentioned when it comes to BB attendance is the stinkin' economy. One didn't have to cruise far on the football boards to see many posters having to make choices about where they were going to spend their dollars re ACCCG or Sugar Bowl so I imagine that many of those same posters haven't gotten rich since January 3rd.

Look, Will - you admitted a couple of years ago that you didn't know what "going hard to the basket" meant so how are you one to really make any judgements about ANY college basketball program - well, you have the right to but not as a subject matter expert.

Chris, you have had a perpetual mad-on about CSG for two years or more - but at least two years. OK, we get it.

But you two need to understand that there are other people out there that do not agree with you - a lot of other people. Secondly, I just don't see how you fire CSG when you take into consideration our basketball history in the last 20+ years. Third, I don't think you two get how tough a sell VT basketball is to recruits, how darn tough this job really is. So quit pointing out the "problems" about CSG without having a solution. Fire CSG and hire a new coach? Who in the heck would we get? If JW fired CSG, the VT basketball job would be radioactive - i.e. it's not a destination job anyway and there are not many mid-major basketball Einsteins that would want the VT job after firing CSG. Especially after so many winning seasons and beating UNC and Duke both when they were #1 and beating them as much if not more so than 95% of the programs out there. My opinion is that you are putting football expectations on the basketball program and that is anything but fair. Remember, over half of the FBS teams get to go to bowls and get their participation trophies - only 19% of the Division I teams get to go to the tournament - a much, much tougher task.

But part of it is me - I'm just so tired of TSL right now and all the Sha Chi going on both the football and basketball boards and now I'm contributing to it. Time to take a huge break until next fall.

I think you are way off base here. First off, I don't see or hear Will chiming in on the situation too much at all. When he does, it is pretty neutral to say the least. As for Chris, he has never indicated he wanted CSG fired. He simply states the facts and asks the question, "have we gone as far as we can go under CSG?" How is that not a legitimate question under the circumstances? We have almost a decade of basketball under our belt in which to judge CSG. Do we need another decade to make a realistic decision?

There may be some wild opinions on both sides of the CSG debate, but Chris and Will do not hold those opinions. In my opinion, Chris has taken a very professional stance on the whole issue, so much that I cannot really tell what he would do if he were "AD for a day." The bottom line is, you are off base saying that they (Will and Chris) are trying to drive CSG out of town. I think the majority of people know we will have CSG for AT LEAST another year, and likely longer; however, when the seat gets warm, people start discussing why it's hot and what our potential options might be.......prepare to see more of this from both Will and Chris in the future......

[HokieJamie]

I don't think that is totally fair to what Will, and moreso CC, has said about CSG and the hoops program.

CC has said for 3-4 years many times on this board that VT is the least desirable ACC job of the 12 schools. That's been openly discussed many times and all of the negatives with getting kids to come play basketball for us.

You cannot compare ACC era VT to the previous 20 years in the Metro, A10 and our nibble in the Big east. That's completely apples and oranges. The ACC move has gotten us a lot more tv exposure that actually helps kids get to know our program.

The question is can CSG take us to the next step that we have been waiting on since 2007? After the MD/JA/TB class failed to make 1 NCAA appearance that's a legit question (and we're not going to discuss whether they deserved to go or not, fact is they were not picked).

Seth is now at 3 NCAA appearances in 23 years of head coaching. We hired a guy who had not made the tourney at all in his previous job (USF).

If your goal is to make the NCAA on a semi consistent basis like the other 11 teams in teh ACC do, then Seth has to make it next year or he's never going to do it.

[Hokie in NC]

I also think his coaching style can be very toxic, with the wrong group of players, especially if they get on a losing streak. That's why I'm particularly worried about this season. Finally, I don't like how he treats some people. Such as responding to question on Tech Talk Live with comments like "Well, I'm glad Tim isn't coaching the team." That's a direct quote from how he responded to someone last week, and I don't like it. That's not our culture at Tech to say things like that to people. Whoever Tim is probably didn't like it very much either. And comments like that from him are fairly common.

Thanks, Chris, for putting it into perspective. Greenberg basically lacks class and I, for one, do not want him representing this university in any capacity!

[Hokie in NC]

Sorry...the first paragraph is from Chris's post. I am still learning this new system.

[OMBandit]

As far as the economy goes, it doesn't help, but it's also been bad for 5+ years. It was never a problem until this year. People are bored of VT hoops, tired of Seth, or really just don't care about hoops afterall. I don't know. But the fact is, they aren't buying tickets or coming to games. And Seth just got a big raise a couple of years ago, on top of that.

And I'm generally the first guy to point out how hard it is to recruit to Virginia Tech. I get more heat for saying that than I have for saying that Seth has taken us as far as he can take us.

Also, point out in the article where I said we should fire him. I've never written anything that flat out said a VT coach should be fired. In fact, I'm on record as saying I'm not sure Weaver is the guy to hire somebody better. I'm afraid he'd go hire Everhart, who has NEVER made the NCAA Tournament, just because it would be an easy hire and because he could get him for cheap. Everhart would be bad for the program long-term, IMO.

As far as Seth goes, as a Tech graduate (not the manager of a VT website), I'm not a huge fan of the way Seth represents the school sometimes. Too much complaining (we beat this team, but they didn't finish in top 50, we lost to this team when the were healthy, etc, etc.), and I think his comments don't sit well with the Selection Committee. How would you like to be called certifiable? I also think his coaching style can be very toxic, with the wrong group of players, especially if they get on a losing streak. That's why I'm particularly worried about this season. Finally, I don't like how he treats some people. Such as responding to question on Tech Talk Live with comments like "Well, I'm glad Tim isn't coaching the team." That's a direct quote from how he responded to someone last week, and I don't like it. That's not our culture at Tech to say things like that to people. Whoever Tim is probably didn't like it very much either. And comments like that from him are fairly common. All of that is just my opinion, as a Tech graduate and a guy who has gone to games for 10 years.

Yeah, and don't forget the post game last year after a tough loss when Roth asked him a question about specific part of the game and he answered that "...people wouldn't understand if he tried to explain it..." Pure arrogance and a jerky attitude.

[B'burg Hokie]

and if a coach's comments can get you excluded from post season play......then there is a lot more wrong with the selection process than we think....at least he tells it like it is and doesn't give "coach speak" like in football

[HokieJamie]

There's a difference between telling it like it is and not filtering your comments at appropriate times. In the end he represents the university, so every comment he makes reflects on VT, not just him.

His comments had nothing to do with whether we got selected or not. If people keep buying into conspiracy theories like that then we just look like dunderheads.